I'm starting to try to write a word document on how I play Omaha 8 and my strategies during specific hands. When I pull up the cake history and copy and paste the document into word (I am using word for the Mac if that makes any difference) the betting history and pot size is accurately documented (albeit in a word format) but the hole cards and the board cards disappear. Any ideas??
If these hand histories are not easily copied, any preferred formats that you have seen in books and magazines for how to present a hand. I kind of like the card player columns titled hand to hand combat for those of you that have seen them, but this format is a bit too detailed for what I had in mind.
Saturday, February 16, 2008
Thursday, February 14, 2008
Bankroll managment, schmankroll management
Has anyone checked out the latest on the Chris Ferguson Challenge? He's down to 9K and change which is less than his 10K goal and WAY off of his peak of what looks to be around $27K or $28K, or roughly three times his current stake. Biffing off 2/3 of your roll with only 5%-10% of your roll at risk is remarkable especially since your buy-in is going to (or at least SHOULD) shrink proportionally as your roll decreases.
I wonder what is happening in Jesus-land? And could it be that we have it all wrong and that Jason-land bankroll management is right? I mean he has the biggest roll of any of the Cakers and ROT will tell you what that means!
I wonder what is happening in Jesus-land? And could it be that we have it all wrong and that Jason-land bankroll management is right? I mean he has the biggest roll of any of the Cakers and ROT will tell you what that means!
Monday, February 11, 2008
Hand dissection: PLO/8
I'm hazy on this but am going with as much as I can recall. Anyone can feel free to let me know details I've fluffed up. Pot Limit Omaha hi/lo last Saturday. Relevant players are all deep stacked enough to be relevant. I pick up As6sQh2h in MP and bump it to six with the nut low draw, double suited, and a bit of counterfeit insurance. Call to my left (Tiff?), Jason, and Ivan. Flop comes out low straighty (something like 678?) and two Diamonds one Spade. I have the nut low and a backdoor flush draw. Ivan leads out for small, maybe 8 or something? I flat call to find get more information. Jason is the only other person to come along to the Turn. Turn I believe changes nothing and the nut straight is still the nut straight. Ivan bets 20. I pop it to 60 now. Jason is like "I can't believe I'm laying this down" and folds. Ivan calls. River changes nothing. Ivan checks to me and I pot it for a big amount. Ivan calls. He has 69 for nut straight and I take the lower portion.
Salient points: Jason successfully put me on A2 from my pre-flop raise AND bowed out of the hand because he was sure he was getting quartered.
I flat called the flop to see what else was going on though I could surely have raised there. Right, wrong? I think A2 in Ivan's hand would have been a bigger bet relative to the pot but I recall it was kinda light. Not sure though. My idea was to wait for a scare card like a Diamond or paired board to allow me to potentially scoop but the Turn didn't help me out. After Ivan bet I raised it as a feeler. If both Jason AND Ivan call I feel an imminent visit from the Q Fairy. Fortunately Jason folds and I'm heads up. Once the river blanks I think my only chance to scoop is to make a big bet and go with my read that Ivan doesn't have a two way hand with a nut low but it is called.
Not sure what the right thing to do here was. It's funny because if I HADN'T raised Jason might not have put me on the nut low and stayed in, much to both of our detriments.
Salient points: Jason successfully put me on A2 from my pre-flop raise AND bowed out of the hand because he was sure he was getting quartered.
I flat called the flop to see what else was going on though I could surely have raised there. Right, wrong? I think A2 in Ivan's hand would have been a bigger bet relative to the pot but I recall it was kinda light. Not sure though. My idea was to wait for a scare card like a Diamond or paired board to allow me to potentially scoop but the Turn didn't help me out. After Ivan bet I raised it as a feeler. If both Jason AND Ivan call I feel an imminent visit from the Q Fairy. Fortunately Jason folds and I'm heads up. Once the river blanks I think my only chance to scoop is to make a big bet and go with my read that Ivan doesn't have a two way hand with a nut low but it is called.
Not sure what the right thing to do here was. It's funny because if I HADN'T raised Jason might not have put me on the nut low and stayed in, much to both of our detriments.
Sunday, February 10, 2008
Starting Hands in Omaha 8
Ryan asked if I would post my starting hands in O8. A difficult question but one I am happy to try to answer. Since I play heads up, 6 handed and 10 handed, starting hands will change for different positions, different # of players, and different types of tables. I have played with the aggro types and 10 handed tables where virtually everyone limps. I will try to rank hands as super premium, premium, OK, speculative, and don't bother. Then adust as you see fit based on table dynamics.
Super Premium
AAxx, I never fold AA preflop, the only hand I will never fold. It is ideal to be heads up with this hand or against a small field. I will occassionally limp with AA, UTG or early position 10 handed with AAxx with xx being junk like 6-10 cards, and rainbow.
Premium
A2xx. I will fold A2xx to a big raise if I limped in early position. A2xx actually plays better against a field than heads up. I raise typically with A2xx single suited, and almost always raise with A2xx double suited.
A23x. A great hand because yhou have counterfeight protection.
KKxx. I love this hand because when a King hits, unlike when an Ace hits on the flop, you are guaranteed there is no made low and the low hands will have to chase. Bet out or check raise with KK when the K hits on the flop and virtually always go to the mat.
QQxx. Another great hand for the same reasons.
Ax suited. I will sometimes fold if facing a big raise preflop but I love to see flops with this hand for obvious reasons. Ax with 6-10, would fall into the good hands category
Good Hands
Pocket 10 tens or Jacks with connecting cards and/or double suited. I like playing JJ,Q,9 single or double suited, but will throw away JJ,6-8 rainbow.
2,3 with another wheel card or double suited. What's so great about a 3 high flush draw. If 2,3 is the obvious nut low being bet into you I would typically just call with another 2,3 and no redraws. If I have a flush draw to go with it, I will raise here and freeroll against the villain.
2,4,5x. 2,4xx is just too hard to play. You are hoping for a A and a 3. It happens just not often enough to get excited.
4 Broadway cards. I know most people like to raise with these hands but I rarely do. I just find this to be a somewhat speculative hand because unless at least 2 of the flop cards are above an 8 I am fighting against the low who won't go away and can scoop against me.
A3xx. Rarely will I fold preflop unless rainbow with 6-10 cards.
A45x. Typically will play even if rainbow.
Speculative hands
2,3xx. Something like 2,3,KQ or 2,3,J,10 I will typically play.
4 connected cards. Hands like 4,5,6,7 are not great, but if you get a few limpers you might get a couple A2xx or A3xx to quarter themselves while you get a straight.
Junk hands
Double pair hands. I hate low pairs, as when you hit trips you are scared of bigger sets, flush draws, straight draws and sharing with the low. Double pair hands like JJ,88 (sorry Ryan) are junk.
All pairs 22 thru 77 unless it comes with premium cards. I tossed 44,xx today when raised by AAxx. The flop was 4,4,x, the turn was an A, but thats ROTTy thinking.
Rainbow hands not connected. Obvious.
4 of one suit hand. Obvious. I played a hand like this today because the ranking of the cards were good. I think it was A,3,Q, 10 or something. 2 of my suit hit on the flop but I did not chase knowing I had so many of my own outs.
Pure Trash
3 of a kind. I will rarely play a AAA,x hand. Maybe if it comes with a 2 or is suited. All other 3 of a kinds I throw away.
Still have yet to be dealt 4 of a kind but I am sure it is coming.
I use a concept called reverse implied odds, meaning what are the chances I will pay off the villains when I am chasing with pure trash hands. Even great poker players pay off villains. In O8 showdown value is so important as the pots tend to be huge and showdowns happen much more often than in Hold'em.
Hope this helps but the real key to success is post flop play just like in Hold'em. This is where are villains are failing. I will try to give some insight to post flop play on my blog when I post at the end of this month.
Good luck at the tables.
Super Premium
AAxx, I never fold AA preflop, the only hand I will never fold. It is ideal to be heads up with this hand or against a small field. I will occassionally limp with AA, UTG or early position 10 handed with AAxx with xx being junk like 6-10 cards, and rainbow.
Premium
A2xx. I will fold A2xx to a big raise if I limped in early position. A2xx actually plays better against a field than heads up. I raise typically with A2xx single suited, and almost always raise with A2xx double suited.
A23x. A great hand because yhou have counterfeight protection.
KKxx. I love this hand because when a King hits, unlike when an Ace hits on the flop, you are guaranteed there is no made low and the low hands will have to chase. Bet out or check raise with KK when the K hits on the flop and virtually always go to the mat.
QQxx. Another great hand for the same reasons.
Ax suited. I will sometimes fold if facing a big raise preflop but I love to see flops with this hand for obvious reasons. Ax with 6-10, would fall into the good hands category
Good Hands
Pocket 10 tens or Jacks with connecting cards and/or double suited. I like playing JJ,Q,9 single or double suited, but will throw away JJ,6-8 rainbow.
2,3 with another wheel card or double suited. What's so great about a 3 high flush draw. If 2,3 is the obvious nut low being bet into you I would typically just call with another 2,3 and no redraws. If I have a flush draw to go with it, I will raise here and freeroll against the villain.
2,4,5x. 2,4xx is just too hard to play. You are hoping for a A and a 3. It happens just not often enough to get excited.
4 Broadway cards. I know most people like to raise with these hands but I rarely do. I just find this to be a somewhat speculative hand because unless at least 2 of the flop cards are above an 8 I am fighting against the low who won't go away and can scoop against me.
A3xx. Rarely will I fold preflop unless rainbow with 6-10 cards.
A45x. Typically will play even if rainbow.
Speculative hands
2,3xx. Something like 2,3,KQ or 2,3,J,10 I will typically play.
4 connected cards. Hands like 4,5,6,7 are not great, but if you get a few limpers you might get a couple A2xx or A3xx to quarter themselves while you get a straight.
Junk hands
Double pair hands. I hate low pairs, as when you hit trips you are scared of bigger sets, flush draws, straight draws and sharing with the low. Double pair hands like JJ,88 (sorry Ryan) are junk.
All pairs 22 thru 77 unless it comes with premium cards. I tossed 44,xx today when raised by AAxx. The flop was 4,4,x, the turn was an A, but thats ROTTy thinking.
Rainbow hands not connected. Obvious.
4 of one suit hand. Obvious. I played a hand like this today because the ranking of the cards were good. I think it was A,3,Q, 10 or something. 2 of my suit hit on the flop but I did not chase knowing I had so many of my own outs.
Pure Trash
3 of a kind. I will rarely play a AAA,x hand. Maybe if it comes with a 2 or is suited. All other 3 of a kinds I throw away.
Still have yet to be dealt 4 of a kind but I am sure it is coming.
I use a concept called reverse implied odds, meaning what are the chances I will pay off the villains when I am chasing with pure trash hands. Even great poker players pay off villains. In O8 showdown value is so important as the pots tend to be huge and showdowns happen much more often than in Hold'em.
Hope this helps but the real key to success is post flop play just like in Hold'em. This is where are villains are failing. I will try to give some insight to post flop play on my blog when I post at the end of this month.
Good luck at the tables.
Chinese Poker exposed card during deal
As Dealer's Choice was winding down, we ended up by playing a round of Chinese Poker. During one of the hands a card was flipped up and exposed for the whole world to see. We ended up getting the second deck and redealing but I posted the question about mis-deals on a poker forum. The funny thing is halfway through writing up my post I realized just how irrelevant seeing one card from another player's hand is. If Royal is positive that I have a 7c in my hand, how can he maximize use of that knowledge? We were four handed so if the 7c was not in his hand it was guaranteed to be in someone else's. And obviously by extension, ANY card not in his hand was guaranteed to be in someone else's. And as we have seen, there are plenty of cases where having another player play his hand face up would not affect the point outcome of the matchup. Even if the action were shorthanded I wonder if there is any utility to knowing a specific card is in someone's hand. Going to have to mull this one over some more.
In the meanwhile, even though there may be a strong case to suggest that it doesn't matter if there is a single known card in someone's hand, I think we should shuffle the card back into the stub and continue dealing as long as there are enough cards left in the stub for any player to receive that card. If it happens while dealing the last card to everyone then I think that a (admittedly lengthy) re-deal should occur.
In the meanwhile, even though there may be a strong case to suggest that it doesn't matter if there is a single known card in someone's hand, I think we should shuffle the card back into the stub and continue dealing as long as there are enough cards left in the stub for any player to receive that card. If it happens while dealing the last card to everyone then I think that a (admittedly lengthy) re-deal should occur.
Friday, February 8, 2008
Tough PLO8 Hand
Setup: You have been playing for a few orbits at full-ring .05/.10 PLO8. As you would expect, there are a lot of flop junkies and not much preflop raising.
Your image: one of the few preflop raisers, you are showing more preflop discipline than most, but it’s doubtful that anyone is paying attention anyway.
Opponent’s Image: sees most flops, and does a lot of calling on the flop and turn. In the previous orbit, you pot-bet him on the flop, turn, and river, and he eventually folded on the river, so he seems to like to call along with drawing hands. He is the big stack and has been since you sat down, but never has stack size had less correlation to player skill than at PLO8.
Your hand: As Ah 9s 2s
You raise pot in MP, getting two callers, including our hand villain from the cutoff seat.
Flop: 8c 7s 3h, giving you the nut low and an overpair.
You bet pot ($1), and villain calls.
Turn: Kd
You bet pot ($3), and villain calls.
River: 2c
What’s your action?
- Lead large
- Lead small
- Check-call any bet
- Check-fold to any bet
- Check-fold to a big bet, check-call a small/medium bet
Monday, February 4, 2008
wife/girlfriend/best friend with benefits rake
Hello WNP and SLP geeks,
Oops, I mean studs. It's mb here. For some reason I can't post on my own account and I have a very pressing question for all of you. Please post your thoughts on what you believe the appropriate rake for those who are "on-line widows" should be. Joe, you are required to consult with Steph regarding this issue. In fact, all of you should be inquiring. Here is my take on it:
1. Time spent on the computer is similar to what a casino or on-line site would charge for the privilege of playing. Because we allow you to take very precious time away from face-to-face time, we should be compensated for this.
2. The standard rake is 10% but I think that more than 10% is appropriate given the fact that the "average" joe (oops, I mean just guy) is way less interesting and thus worth less than you brilliant and oh so engaging gentlemen. Time that is "taken" from us should be duly compensated.
3. This is a win-win situation. You guys win money... the sig. others win money. I mean, what is there to actually think about?
4. For those of you who are not legally committed (dating or engaging in benefits), I think that 10-20% is sufficient. However, for those who have more at stake (wives, children (current or soon to be) and/or pets I believe that 25% is adequate.
Thoughts? Please feel free to share...
mb
Oops, I mean studs. It's mb here. For some reason I can't post on my own account and I have a very pressing question for all of you. Please post your thoughts on what you believe the appropriate rake for those who are "on-line widows" should be. Joe, you are required to consult with Steph regarding this issue. In fact, all of you should be inquiring. Here is my take on it:
1. Time spent on the computer is similar to what a casino or on-line site would charge for the privilege of playing. Because we allow you to take very precious time away from face-to-face time, we should be compensated for this.
2. The standard rake is 10% but I think that more than 10% is appropriate given the fact that the "average" joe (oops, I mean just guy) is way less interesting and thus worth less than you brilliant and oh so engaging gentlemen. Time that is "taken" from us should be duly compensated.
3. This is a win-win situation. You guys win money... the sig. others win money. I mean, what is there to actually think about?
4. For those of you who are not legally committed (dating or engaging in benefits), I think that 10-20% is sufficient. However, for those who have more at stake (wives, children (current or soon to be) and/or pets I believe that 25% is adequate.
Thoughts? Please feel free to share...
mb
Sunday, February 3, 2008
An Omaha/Hold'em hybrid Tuesday?
With the unrelenting popularity of Omaha, I was wondering if there would be interest in maybe squeezing in some Omaha on Tuesday's. Maybe if we got people to show up early and we could do a 6:00-7:30 stint of Omaha then cut over to Hold'em since we haven't really been starting right at 7 anyway. Or is it going to be too hard to get people to the game on time to start at 6:00? I don't know how unfettered we want to leave Tuesday Night Poker. We could do Omaha on a weekend I suppose but it sure seems like there is strong interest among the weeknighters to play some Omaha. Thoughts?
Saturday, February 2, 2008
Subscribe to:
Posts (Atom)