Tuesday, September 11, 2007

TNP Online Poker Challenge

Ok kids lets set some guidelines and goals. It was brought up in the other bankroll post, and I think it's an awesome idea.

Whomever is in starts a CakePoker account, deposits the same amount as everyone else, and we see what we can get it to in a given amount of time or whatever.

$50.00 (ahem play money naturally since we live in WA ahem cough) seems reasonable. I think the guidelines should be something like you can do whatever you want (SNG, micro, take shots) strategy wise, but you have to be honest and report your situations. What limits did you play? How were you playing? Hand histories?

We should set a time frame and see who can build it up the most (or not go busto at least). It would be really really interesting to see we all approach it and what works and doesn't work.

I think this would be more of a learning experience than a competition per se. I know you guys have to have more ideas involving this, so let's hear 'em!


Sushi Cowboy said...

I don't see a reason for not just using play money (no cough) since the principles would be the same IMO. I think that the play quality between funny money and micro-limits is likely to be similar enough for our purposes, plus there are no other issues complicating the contest. I think the ideal situation would be to open coughless play money accounts on a site that has full hand histories so we can have full documentation. My guess is that no one tracks play money play though. Second best option I guess is to open an account with cough play money and track all progress so we can all learn lessons from each other. It also seems like it would be best to measure results based on ROI of action somehow. If we have a time based challenge then I think that would promote d0nkage by getting into bankroll-unfriendly games in an attempt to double up quickly. I'm also not sure if it is an advantage for people who have more time to play than others.

I have my preferences of how it is run but I'll bow to the sentiment of the masses.

Ryan said...

I want to do real money because I want to win money playing poker.

I mean, go the play route if you want, but I want to try the Ferguson Method out for money...

I would further suggest that we all try to adopt Ferguson's ground rules with a $50 stake and see how his approach translates for the WNP crew.

But you know, whatever. I'm going to start with $50 on cake and adhere strictly to the Ferguson rules and see where it gets me. If anyone wants to do that in parallel with me, awesome.

Marshall said...

Martin: there is no point to doing play money. You can learn almost nothing from it, except basic mechanics IMO. If you want to try to run up a huge play money bankroll, go for it. But its not real money, there aren't enough limits/games to give a good selection, and it would feel pointless cause you could reload at any time for free.

Ryan, what did you mean by "we all adopt Ferguson's ground rules with a ..."?

I was thinking we could use whatever strategy we wanted to try to build up a roll over time, and periodically check with each other about what is working and what isn't. How we are playing etc.

Anyone else interested or is it just Ry and I?

Ryan said...

By Ferguson's ground rules, I was referring to his methodology for going from $0 to $10K on full tilt, per Martin's earlier post:


Chris built up his bankroll by adhering to this strict set of guidelines:

* He never buys into a cash game or a Sit & Go with more than 5 percent of his total bankroll (there is an exception for the lowest limits: he is allowed to buy into any game with a buy-in of $2.50 or less).

* He doesn’t buy into a multi-table tournament for more than 2 percent of his total bankroll, but he’s allowed to buy into any multi-table tournament that costs $1.

* If at any time during a No-Limit or Pot-Limit cash-game session the money on the table represents more than 10 percent of his total bankroll, he must leave the game when the blinds reach him.

Sushi Cowboy said...

I said that I'd be down for whatever, just that I wanted to avoid the issue of funding an account. I've played with a play money account and built it up over time. It is not pure d0nkage. There are players who really care about playing real poker on there as well. I haven't played real money micro-limits but I can't imagine the quality of play at a $1 buy in (if you are following Fergusons guidelines) MTT being substantially different from a free roll or play money. But like I said, just tell me the ground rules and I'm in.

Bob Loblaw said...

I'd like to participate as well, but will be severely limited by the amount of time I can play.

Plus -- can any of you see any reason why I shouldn't play poker on my work-owned laptop?

Sushi Cowboy said...

Using your work owned machine for poker? During work hours? Maybe not a good idea.

If we use a site the requires a client then there might be issues. a) Platform compatibility if you have a Mac and aren't running a Wintel emulator of some sort b) company policy c) machine privileges locking down what you can install (somehow I don't think this would be done at your place).

If you have an Intel Mac then you could always do a boot camp partition for poker software...but then it would be hard to get work done at same time!

Marshall said...

Ok well lets come up with some guidelines. I don't think that Jesus' guidelines should have any weight with how you decide to build your roll. If you want to use his, no problem, if you want to try something else, or a hybrid of the two, go for it. But keep some track or idea of what you are doing. What is your gameplan before even starting? As we go, what is working and what is not?

I don't really like setting a deadline either, but at the same time, we should have a long term( but not TOO long term) goal of some sort.

We could have a weekly check-in or something like that to say how we are, if we went busto etc.

Any other thoughts?

Austin said...

Sounds good to me, I'm in. Maybe this will cause me to play a little smarter.

Bob Loblaw said...

I haven't had a chance to look at Cake Poker yet, but, as Martin said, if it's a PC-only solution, I'm going to have to sit this one out. I'm on a Mac, and don't have install privileges. And no, I wouldn't be playing during work hours, but I would be playing on my work machine. My G4 at home has gotten to the point where it's too slow to bother.

I'll look at Cake Poker tonight to see if I can play on my Mac.

Marshall said...

Royal- I think we should do Cake if we can, that way we are playing against the same player pool and have the same stakes available to us, but I don't think it's exclusive to Cake.

If you can't get on that site, then by all means participate on Full Tilt which has a Mac version of their software. As far as your work computer goes, I would avoid it simply because its illegal (felony) in WA to gamble online, including poker.

The chances of anything happening to you are very slim, but to the law and possibly your employer, it could be punishable the exact same way that having kiddie porn or something that should actually be illegal would be.


If you can't get on Cake, use whatever site you have available to you, but maybe not on your work computer. (its up to you though, you know your company and your computer better than anyone)

Bob Loblaw said...

All true. I knew the illegal and felony stuff, I just wanted to know if any of you had heard any precedent about it. I don't think my office would even care if they did find out I was playing poker on the computer, and I also have heard that the state has not arrested anybody on that new law.

Either way, I think this sorta test would be best done on the same poker site. I think I'd only slow things up by playing irregularly on Full Tilt, and sure enough I can't play on Cake Poker on my Mac. I'll just glean what I can from what you guys all learn, and then apply that to my irregular play on Full Tilt sometime in the future.

Marshall said...

Regarding the laws: Well there are 3 laws to consider here.

1. The Unlawful Internet Gaming Act. This is the federal law passed, and does not make it illegal to play. It does make it illegal for financial institutions to deposit money to companies that do online gambling(including poker)

2. WA state's law against online gambling. This has been around for a long time. I have never seen/heard of anyone getting pinched(cool mafia word) for playing poker online.

3. WA state's new amendment to the old law: now its a low level felony. Whatever. I would LOVE to get arrested for playing poker online. It would be a NIGHTMARE for them to convict me. And I would make it my life mission to have this injustice and unconstitutionality brought to light.

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