Sunday, November 11, 2007

Pass the Trash

I don't know how Ryan infected our pristine WSOP only mixed game with that blasphemous game, Pass the Trash but that thing sure is addictive. The way Ryan explained it to me, his dad plays it with additional betting rounds. I think one after the deal and another after the swap? Ryan's (sound) reasoning was that it eliminated some "extra" betting rounds but now that I've mulled it over some more I think that the early rounds are there to build a pot (as opposed to antes/blinds) and also mix in the soul crushing element of being dealt four to the straight flush and wanting to pump the pot and then bricking after the swap but being tempted to still represent it.

The hands take a while as is so I don't know if we would be interested in adding another one but what do people think about a "pro-flop" round of betting?

I also forgot to bring the alternate set of game cards which show the current game and stakes but I really want to try stepped limit with PtT next time because I think it will add to the game. For that matter, I think stepped limit would add to any limit game by gradually raising stakes and allowing a greater degree of pot control and being able to price people out.

And as a side note, I read in Super System I that Stud hi/lo USED to be played as a declare game as well. I'm sure it still is in some circles but the "cards speak" version is so much easier for casinos to run plus it will churn more hand/hour through. Just think about how hard declarations would be when your opponent has THREE hidden cards!


Ryan said...

My dad’s group does not play with extra betting rounds, I have just read about other people’s variation on the net and found that some employ pre- and post-pass betting rounds. We tried it, though, and I don’t think anyone was ever willing to fold before the pass. Of all the things we’ve tried so far, I liked the “stiff ante, high card acts first” approach best.

My dad’s group actually plays *all* of their games with straights and flushes counting against low hands, so in their PTT, the nut low is 6432A, and there is no “scoop” declare option. I think their “seven deuce” mentality is bad for most of the games they play with a low (especially PTT and the lack of a scoop attempt), and tried at one point to convince them that standard “real” poker low rules were better. I learned quickly that when in Rome, don’t try to teach old Romans new tricks.

I call O8 in that game a lot, and that’s the one time they allow “wheel as the nut low” poker rankings, since wheel-based low rules are at the heart of game.

Sushi Cowboy said...

OK, I misunderstood then about your dad's group.

Now that you mention it I guess we did do an opening betting round one didn't we? I get so confused on mixed nights.

I suppose stiff ante works fine. The only person who is going to be pushing super hard before the pass is someone with dealt quads. Everyone else is going to only have a draw to a nutty hand.

So is half a small bet stiff enough in fixed limit? Should we standardize on that? What should it be if we go with stepped limit?

Marshall said...

What do you mean buy stepped limit? Doesn't it already step from 4 to 8?

Sushi Cowboy said...

Hmmm. I guess that term is not standard and only we use a Google search would seem to indicate.

Based on my email archives it appears that Ryan coined that term and it refers to a different betting limit for each round. In Ryan's case he was calling for stepped limit Omaha where bets were 3 chips pre-flop, 6 chips on the flop, 9 chips for the turn, and 12 chips at the river.

I know I've seen other instances where there were more than two increments in fixed limit betting but I am too lazy to find them right now. I think it was something like a 4/8 game but pre-flop was only 2 or something like that?

Anyway, I thought the stepped limit Omaha game was a very good compromise between not being able to protect with limit and the wackiness of pot limit. I forgot to bring my new set of game cards or else we could have tried it on Saturday night.

Marshall said...

Let's do it backwards. 12 preflop, and it goes down from there. ahha